CS caught up with Dan O’Rourke founder of Not To Scale, and Santino (Tino) Sladavic, Partner and Executive Producer of Not To Scale New York.
How would you describe your job to an alien?
(Dan) Through the art of film I help to create little stories that hopefully connect with the other Earthlings, transporting them somewhere else for a moment, elevating them to a slightly happier status and so helping them to forget how insignificant our problems and our little planet is in the grand scheme of things. This feeling may last a microsecond or longer depending on the success of the film and the poignancy of its message.
(Tino) I get paid to work with amazing artists and creative people using all different types of film techniques…when a projects finished I get to watch them on the TV, internet or even in theatres!
How did it all start, and how have you got to where you are today?
(Dan) After a very traditional English education, I somehow managed to break away from the 1940’s and the paths destined for me and study my love of film at University. This led to learning a career producing commercials for Agencies, starting out working for the Saatchi brothers in the 90’s at their new start-up M&C Saatchi. A few shrewd agency moves later and I managed to get back onto the ‘getting your hands dirty’ side of filmmaking at Nexus where I learnt all about the craft of animation before leaving to start Not To Scale in 2005.
(Tino) It’s all about preparation and opportunity. I was out of the business for 2 years. It was tough to break back in because the industry was changing so fast and everyone had already forgotten about me. I got booked on a freelance gig for 4 days and somehow 2 months later I was the company’s executive producer. 3 companies and 8 years later I’m a partner at Not To Scale.
Which projects that you’ve been involved with, are you most proud of?
(Dan) Proud of them all but some things that stand out for a moment if I close my eyes; being asked by Led Zeppelin to make the visuals for them to play in front of for their encore at their reunion gig at the O2 in London, shooting with Ronaldo for Nike, working directly with Burberry to make content for their mega store opening in Malaysia being asked by Google to help them make an equally important film, the studio being nominated for a BAFTA last year, there’s too many, perhaps generally just working with some of the best Agencies and Brands in the world on a consistent basis.
(Tino) I did an amazing campaign for Scion called “little deviants” I’m proud of that because of all the hate mail I received claiming I was a devil worshiper. I also produced the Gnarls Barkley “Crazy” video, which we shot, edited and animated in 2 weeks.
What are the biggest challenges you’re faced with in your work at the moment and how do you overcome them?
(Dan) There has been a flux of brands commissioning content for their newly gotten social media channels who have never had to do so before, they often aren’t aware of what necessitates a good film, in terms of the process and the correct allocation of time and budget. It’s a bit like somebody just invented trousers (pants), everyone wants them now, but some people only have a dollar and a day to get theirs, and they want the best there is, and so we have to be discerning about which orders we can take to keep to our own high standards as we don’t want to go out of business for selling cheap, rubbish trousers if I can stretch the fabric of that analogy to it’s fullest.
(Tino) The biggest challenges right now getting clients to not take the safe route. I feel like the industry has gotten scared of their clients and few are trying new things because they’re afraid to lose them.
What’s been your biggest learning throughout your career so far?
(Dan) Precisely that you are always learning, right throughout your career, as was carved in wood, in Greek, above my old school library, ‘Learning is Lifelong’. Be receptive to everything new, and challenge yourself to learn new things all of the time.
(Tino) Patience and the understanding that it’s a war and not a battle. That there will be more opportunities if you keep pushing.
What’s the most interesting thing you’ve seen recently?
(Dan) Oddly the Star Tours ride at Disney Land in Los Angeles last week, it is a fully 3D interactive film the room moves and throws you around in perfect synch with the film, it’s an alternative reality unlike anything I’ve personally experienced, as close to being in a film as perhaps is possible for an audience, it caused me to reflect how much cinema, home cinema and gaming as theatre still has the potential to evolve. Technology like ‘Oculus Rift’ are touching on this now, but a room that had a cast member in the room, whilst the room was programmed to move with the camera, in three dimensions, that was quite an incredible experience.
(Tino) A wolf spider. It was in the wine cellar at my girl friend’s parent’s house in Raleigh, NC.
What’s the best piece of advice you’ve ever been given?
(Dan) If you were starting your business again tomorrow, what would it look like?
(Tino) Never ask a question you don’t want to know the answer to.
Where do you do your best thinking?
(Dan) When I’m pottering about the London Studio, tidying things. If I’ve a lot on my mind a small OCD part of me has the over-powering urge to tidy up bits and pieces around our studio whilst I think things over in my mind. I march up and down the stairs or around my desk, I think everyone has got used to it but it does draw the odd look of puzzlement. I’ve been known to do the same thing at our New York and Amsterdam studios when I’m there.
(Tino) It must be in my sleep…because sometimes I’ll suffer over the correct answer for days…then all of a sudden I’ll wake up on a Wednesday and I’ll just have the answer and know it to be right.
If you could travel in time, where would you go and what would you do?
(Dan) Assuming somebody else has already gone back and taken care of the despots and plagues. I would definitely travel back in time, not forward, our existence is more comfortable now then ever before but the world is getting messy, I’m not sure I would want to see how it will play out, ‘ Planet Of The Apes’ is probably optimistic. I would go back to Edwardian England, start a little gallery in Mayfair representing impressionist and abstract artists. Of course I would be armed with today’s market information and people would marvel at my prescience, representing Gauguin, Matisse, Picasso et al. my career would run through both wars and (following active service) leave enough time for me to represent Bacon and other British and American contemporaries whilst drinking and having fun, food and fights with them all in the bars and restaurants of Soho.
(Tino) Medieval Times, of course, to slay some dragons.
If you could work with anyone on a project, who would it be and what would you do?
(Dan) No idea, okay, I would Executive Produce the next film for Marty and Leo, ha.
(Tino) I recently came very close to working with Paul McCartney. That would have been the ultimate experience. Who doesnt want to work with a Beatle?
Tell us something about yourself that not many people know?
(Dan) I was the most slippered boy at my prep school, I’ve had a problem with rules and self anointed authority all of my life, since day one, they tried to kick me out of cub scouts and the boy scouts too, it was never misbehaviour through malice, only comedy.
(Tino) I want to own a clothing line in the future.
If you could go back and do one thing differently, what would it be?
(Dan) I’d be more careful about who I went into business with, it’s a little like a marriage only more expensive and disappointing if it does not work out.
(Tino) Had I known what I wanted to do with my life when I was 17, I probably would’ve gone to school in Los Angeles instead of the infamous Chico State in Northern California. Not that didn’t love my experience at Chico…it was incredible believe me…and I have the stories to prove it. But looking back from a networking perspective for the advertising and entertainment industry, it probably would’ve behooved me to go to school in LA or NY.
Who or what have had the biggest influences on your work?
(Dan) South London first and then in later life, East London. I grew up in and around grimy, gritty Croydon, where youth culture, and belonging to a tribe was a sure fire way to discover another more exciting world. I was a young Mod, honorary member of South Croydon Mods before I was then hanging out with them, wearing the clothes, then came Casuals, then The Smiths, Acid House and then Blur, after hoovering up British music and fashion I went to college and further discovered my innate love of images and imagery, photography, film and art had always ticked boxes inside, and hanging out in Shoreditch in the late 90’s and 00’s became a place full of artists, gallerists, musicians, designers and illustrators that would inspire you in your own work daily. I still live in Dalston, Hackney today and can’t think of anywhere else in London at the moment that I’d rather live. If you wanted a visual span of the times and places summed up by two photographers look at the work of Chris Dorley-Brown, and Stephane Duroy’s photos of Great Britain.
(Tino) My friends in general. The ones that work hard and not only kill it for their clients but also take the time to make stuff for themselves. They are inspirational
What’s next?
(Dan) I have my hands very much full developing the continued growth of our London, New York studio and our new studio in Amsterdam. We also have a couple of divisions Larger Than Life (experiential), and Past The Post (VFX) that have much more exciting potential to become stronger more independent businesses. Other than that who indeed knows ever what is coming next, all we can do is try to be a little ready for the best and the worst, and try not to get too flummoxed by either.
(Tino) Well I think tomorrow is Wednesday. I’m sure I’ll wake up and think of something.
Dan O’Rourke (@orork)
Tino Sladavic (@tinoslad)